Episode 200!!

Join Rob and Jason as they celebrate 200 episodes of the Church Talk Podcast, share exciting updates about launching their YouTube channel, new website features, and their ongoing mission to equip and encourage pastors and church leaders. Discover their insights on leadership, faith, and staying true to their mission amidst challenges.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:00

Hey everybody, welcome back to the Church Talk Podcast with Rob and Jason. Rob, you are blowing me away with the festive shirt that you're wearing. It is Happy birthday. It's not my birthday.

SPEAKER_01 0:18

It's not even I mean happy anniversary.

SPEAKER_03 0:21

No, it's not my anniversary. I have no idea what you're talking about.

SPEAKER_01 0:25

Well, I suppose it's not really the birthday, not for you or me, of the podcast or the anniversary even of the podcast. We're actually coming in on four years. Yeah. But what this is is our 200th episode, and I decided to dress up for it. Woo!

SPEAKER_03 0:46

Two hundredth episodes. That is that is amazing. And I don't know what to say about the shirt. I I wish people could see it. Is there any way we could get to the point where people could see this amazing robness of a shirt?

SPEAKER_01 1:04

I mean, you know what? You're kind of the back end guy, so I don't know. Like that's a that's a you thing, but I think we do have some announcements, right? And that's kind of a big one.

SPEAKER_03 1:15

I think that is a big one, and and maybe this this will have to be the first episode that we drop on YouTube on our own YouTube channel. And I will put the links and everything in the show notes. We will be launching our brand new YouTube channel on June the 3rd, which is just a couple days after this episode comes out. We will, you know, post on social media and stuff if anybody needs a link, but we have our own YouTube channel just for Rob and Jason and the Church Talk Podcast. May God have mercy on us all.

SPEAKER_01 1:53

Well, and again, this is like uh this isn't gonna change for those of you who like listen in your car or whatever, and and so the audio will still hit all the places the audio hits. Yeah. That we're not forcing you to look at us. And, you know, just like in all fairness, we have numerous times, maybe even dozens of times over these 200 episodes, we have given our listeners fair warning that you and I have the face for audio only. So, you know, I don't I don't know what if I'm like encouraging people, like when you watch a basketball game and someone's leg snaps in half because they landed the wrong way and that they keep replaying it over and over and again, you're like, oh, it's so awful, but you can't look away, you know what I mean? I don't know if it's encouraging people to check out the YouTube thing for that reason, or if it's just kind of a mild warning that you might just want to keep listening to audio only and avoid seeing us. You know, you guys, you guys take that and do with it what you will.

SPEAKER_03 2:51

That's right. That's right. And and we will hopefully be adding content to uh even the YouTube channel that maybe is little snippets, uh things from a podcast that maybe if you don't want to listen to the whole thing, but we've got you know a five-minute chunk of stuff that you could you could highlight. Uh, we've got all those already broken out and ready. And so we'll uh we'll just start dripping that over the next two years, haha, right? Uh uh where we just you know start because we've got a lot of episodes ready and a lot of content ready that we're just gonna start dripping out so that you can you can see it as well and you can find it on YouTube. That's the other thing is uh I'm I'm just hearing a lot of people say, man, I I I wish you guys were on YouTube because that's what I you know that's what I use all the time for searching things and whatever. And so we're gonna we're making the jump, my friends. And and I don't remember my mind just went blank as to who told us this. Uh Matt, I think. Uh William, anyway, it'll come to me. But he was talking about jump making the jump to YouTube. He this was, you know, we interviewed him, but then afterwards we were talking about this, and and he gave us a book.

SPEAKER_01 4:00

Yes, the book and the Bible and short snippets and whatever.

SPEAKER_03 4:04

This one. That one, the lightning guide. Yes, Matt Whitman. He warned us. He gave us fair warning. He said, Listen, once you make the jump to YouTube, you have to make sure that you stay true to yourself because the feedback loop on video is so much faster than the feedback loop on a podcast. And he said, You're gonna get something that goes viral and it's gonna be right on the edge of what you actually are all about, and you're just gonna start leaning into those things, and you're gonna end up down a path you didn't want to go. And so that was uh that was a nice warning, and we have taken it to heart.

SPEAKER_01 4:39

Jason, I think like we should do the scouts honor thing, even though I don't know if you were ever a scout, I wasn't a scout. I I was that what you do? I think this is what you do. I think it's three, I don't even know what it is.

SPEAKER_03 4:48

Or we could do like the Vulcan thing, or I don't know My My arthritic hands won't quite do that.

SPEAKER_01 4:53

But uh Yeah, because the other thing he said was, you know, like and you kind of just alluded to that was like the algorithm tries to kind of control you. And if you get like a gazillion likes and downloads for one thing, but then the next week have like virtually none, it's it's like, hey, we're gonna push this out in a way that rewards you for talking about something we want you to talk about. And it's like, here's the thing we scout's honor, we are going to stay true. We kind of actually I we always joke about this with me. I try to break the algorithm, you know, with the with you know, my whatever. But yeah, we're we're gonna do what we do, and we don't care if there's like a lot of listens and likes or or if you if we can help people who are trying to follow Jesus and serve him, um, we're gonna keep doing that.

SPEAKER_03 5:41

Yeah. Well, and and our our vision from day one was we want to engage, equip, and encourage pastors and leaders. And that's gonna remain the vision, no matter if it's on YouTube, if it's on audio only, if there's some new thing out there that you know we don't know about yet, that's gonna be a great thing. Uh, anytime you and I travel together and you know, we've done a couple trainings at different churches, and that's still what we do. We're all about that because number one, we love pastors, and we just think, you know, we we want the local pastor to be the hero of the story, and that we want them to really rise to the top and and celebrate just the the way they've been obedient and faithful and the calling that God has placed on their life. And we love the local church. Uh, we just think it's if Jesus loves, you know, the local church as his bride, then we probably ought to be in love with the bride as well. And so we're gonna do everything we can to to serve the bride in that. And and it, let's be honest, it's kind of fun too.

SPEAKER_01 6:38

It is, it is. Jason, so we uh we have that was like our big announcement for our 200th episode, but we have some other announcements related to our website that we've really had for a long time. We've just not promoted it, we've really not spent a lot of time building it out, you know, because we haven't, it's kind of been more of a in the background kind of thing. But one of the things that I'm really excited about with our website, which, you know, in a lot of a lot of organizations, a lot of things, it's this is a secondary deal where, you know, I almost skim past this, but in 200 episodes now, we have had the privilege to interview some people. We've had the the privilege to, you know, be introduced to some pretty cool parachurch ministries and organizations. And and what I'm about to say doesn't apply to all of those. Um, it maybe it could apply to many of them, but man, for some of these people and and works, you know, we have gotten to sort of peek behind the curtain a little bit more, do a little bit more of a deep dive, and like we would really say, man, like what this person is doing, what these people are doing, what this organization is is accomplishing is just so helpful in serving and meeting the needs of the local church. And so as part of our website, you've been like kind of working on, you know, having some affiliate links where people, you know, could get connected, um, even sometimes, you know, maybe get a little bit better of a deal or or whatever. That's not the point because like anyone who shows up on like our affiliates links page are are gonna be people and organizations that we really trust and believe in. And so we want this to be a place that's just a great resource. If you're like, man, I am looking for some legal help. You know, you can go and click on Regan Van Steenis' organization, who's been on the podcast a couple times, and and she's gonna be a great resource and help in those areas.

SPEAKER_03 8:36

Yes, absolutely. And just for everybody, so you know, our our uh actual uh web address is the church talk. It's actually www.churchtalkproject.com. It's it's not church talk podcast. The church talk podcast is a part of the church talk project. And so we we just want everyone to to know where to go so you can, you know, you can catch up on all the stuff. And yeah, we I am putting together some some partner links, uh, you know, like a resource page where you can see some of the, you know, just have find an easy link to some of these resources because man, I'm I, you know, I was just thinking, I was looking back through the 200 episodes, kind of scrolling through and just seeing. And it's like we have had some pretty amazing people on the podcast with some pretty amazing ministries that I would I'm just like wow, that that's that's amazing that we have connected with just that many high quality, high capacity people. Yeah, including you, Rob.

SPEAKER_01 9:42

Whoa. Yeah, yeah. You know, uh, and so uh related to the website, we have another thing that we're gonna start uh doing. And so, you know, if you have if you're someone who comes and listens, you know, regularly and uh, you know, that like this has just become part of your life and you've enjoyed it, you benefited from it or whatever, on our website, we're gonna have a button. Do we have a button already? Yes. Yeah, all right, where you can click to basically give us your your email address if you would trust us with that. Again, you know, Scouts Honor, whatever, Vulcan Mind Meld, whatever, you know, like this is not uh we're trying to build a big list so that we can sell it or monetize it or any of those things. But we want to um every month start pushing out, you know, just some information. You know, maybe it's been a busy month from you and you've missed some episodes, but there's been you know a great resource or a highlight. I'm thinking back to that great thing that Danny Parmaley does that he talked about, right? For our listeners, he kind of gave a a discount or free access to his uh his assessment, right? Where pastors can like do an assessment. You know, so maybe if someone missed that, we want to in a monthly way push out some information that we think might be helpful or some resources or even just some highlights from the podcast, just one time a month. So we're not gonna blow up your inbox, but we just you know want to give you things in a way that might be a little bit more accessible and really help encourage, equip, and engage with you. So if you would go to our website and click on that link or the little butt of the button and give us your email address, uh, we would love for you to be a part of that.

SPEAKER_03 11:20

Yes, absolutely. And I'm just gonna throw in one more thing that we're gonna, it's it's really already there, but we just haven't activated it on the website. We we have a blog uh where we've just you and I have contributed a few articles over the last couple of years, and we're gonna start, we're gonna activate that, you know, module of the website, whatever that's called, and uh you can go and just see, and some of it's just our musings on things like I've got uh an eight-part series already done on when I visited a casino and what that was like, and and comparing it to a person going to the church to going to a church for the first time. And and so, yeah, so that one will, you know, we'll start dripping those out next week as well.

SPEAKER_01 12:00

Should should we tell our listeners that the reason we've been able to do this for 200 episodes, because we've never really done anything to monetize anything, uh, but the way we can afford this is because Jason struck it rich at the casino.

SPEAKER_03 12:13

We cannot tell them that because that is not true.

SPEAKER_01 12:16

I didn't even know about this whole casino thing. I may have to reevaluate my participation in all this, knowing you're you're you know gambling addicted now.

SPEAKER_03 12:25

Well, here's the the great thing about it. If you read the pieces, you know, like I never even bet a dollar because I couldn't figure it out.

SPEAKER_01 12:33

You know, and I'm sure you talk all about this in one of those those things, but you know, I've uh been on a few cruises. Uh Bethany and I went on for a 10th anniversary. Um a buddy invited me to come help with like a Steelers fan cruise. And then that same friend, my whole family went on the first ever San Francisco 49ers fan cruise. And so those are a few cruises that I've I've been on in my lifetime. And they position in a lot of those ships like a casino kind of right in the middle where you you have to kind of go through it, or it's the most expedient way to get from point A to point B is to walk through the casino. And they do that, I'm sure, on purpose to kind of like all the lights and and excitement and action, and like if I like maybe I'll just throw a buck in this or you know, try that, and then and then all of a sudden maybe you're hooked, right? But yeah, like I still remember Bethany and I are 10th anniversary, and she was like so because she, I mean, she's just like, I mean, and even grew up in an environment where if you even thought about gambling, you're probably going straight to hell, right? So, so like this is just weird, and she's like, I'm I'm telling information here that I probably shouldn't, but she was just like, Could I take like five dollars or ten dollars and just like try? Because it's just like I'll just like play a slot machine or whatever. I'm like, I don't give a rip, like you can do that, that's fine with me. And but now it's not like you know, when we were kids and we had those little toys where it's like if you got three cherries or three bananas or three oranges, like you win the jackpot. No, like it like there's like 87 things on the deal and it goes diagonal and sideways, and like I mean, yeah, there is absolutely no way any sane human being knows how to like, and then you even if you won, you'd be like, I won? I don't know how I won. I mean, like, yeah, it is crazy.

SPEAKER_03 14:18

It is well, and I walked around to all the the gaming side, but not the not the video stuff, but they had actual, you know, the the dealer tables and they had like all these different card games and whatever, and I'm like, I didn't even understand half of them, much less, you know, how to approach them. I didn't even know exactly where to go to change my money into into the whatever, you know, the chips and stuff that they use there. Like I was just and and the only reason I was there was because I was going to, you know, the Eagle Brook Association out in Minnesota area, right? I was going out there for they had asked me to come out to attend one of their conference thingies, whatever. And I had asked one of the guys, hey, what's a hotel around there that I could, you know, well, you know, it's a casino, but besides that, they give us a great corporate rate. If you use this one, you can get, you know, get a really cheap rate. Like, all right, I'm fine with that. So I was staying at this hotel and I was like really hungry one night, but it was late, and I was 20 minutes from a restaurant, but there's a restaurant in the casino, and that was the only way. So I just like, oh, let's go see what's going on. And and I'm usually pretty adventurous in that stuff, but it was intimidating uh in a lot of ways.

SPEAKER_01 15:28

Yeah, you went to a church event and came away addicted to gambling. All right. I mean, you heard it here. We another major announcement that you know I did I didn't even know about or anticipate.

SPEAKER_03 15:39

I'm too poor to gamble.

SPEAKER_01 15:42

Well, you know, that actually usually is a connection. It's like that like that's the pathway out of poverty. People people believe that lie and then get themselves in even worse trouble, right? We could probably have a whole podcast episode on that notion at some point. No, I uh I'm I was thinking about uh I just lost my train of thought. Never mind.

SPEAKER_03 16:04

Well, fine. Yeah, so we we talked about the YouTube channel, we talked about the uh the partner links on the website, we talked about the blog.

SPEAKER_01 16:14

That's what I was thinking. Yeah, it was like a few years ago where you're like, hey, let's do a blog. And I like in like one day wrote three articles and sent them to you. And then you were like, well, we'll get to that at some point. Now it's like three years later. Now you're telling me like so you you have those still kind of like Yep, they are queued up.

SPEAKER_03 16:33

Yep, you don't have to write them again. I mean, I'll I'll look over and make sure they don't suck, but I doubt it.

SPEAKER_01 16:38

Yeah, they're kind of mid. No, they're good, they're good. If I remember correctly, it was a long time ago. Remember, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 16:44

No, they're they're queued up, so they're already they're already in the in the system. So I I'm excited to see how we can just expanding this in a way that helps pastors more than just you know a podcast. Uh this is great and I love this, but I also want to want to keep finding ways to equip and resource pastors. And you know, you and I both work with uh Converge Mid-Atlantic, and you know, I'm full-time staff and you help in a lot of ways and kind of I don't know, you you get paid a little bit occasionally to do some stuff, but I mean you you're all in. But regional direct. No, no, they're area coordinators now, aren't they? Didn't we change the name at the last meeting? I think we did because remember, National changed all the names, and so we had to, it's ridiculous and yeah, whatever.

SPEAKER_01 17:30

What I do has been named a hundred different things over the last whatever.

SPEAKER_03 17:34

Yes. What you do is help pastors, and so that's a good thing. Yeah. So, but you know, all that to say, like we I we have ways of of helping pastors within our tribe, but what I love about the Church Talk Project and the Church Talk Podcast is we get to help and serve churches way beyond our tribe. And and we get to interact with some people and and some you know, pastors and leaders that don't even know what converge is. And that may uh for me, that just is really that's just really rewarding to be able to connect with people like that. So that's why we have this separate website that really is focused on you know how we as just the two of us doing our little project together can help.

SPEAKER_01 18:17

Yeah. And Jason, I loved what you said, and maybe just to give like a little bit more context to like the church talk project, you know, that really is the umbrella over, you know, and up to this point, you maybe if someone has has heard that, because we have we have sort of said that out loud, and every time we take we went mention our email addresses or our website, you know, they might go, I thought this was the church talk podcast. Well, the podcast has really been kind of the main forward-facing element, but you know, for you and I, like the plan has always been to build out some other tools and resources and things just to continue helping this. And you and I have even talked a little bit. I don't know like if it'll fall under this umbrella, but like I think that it could and maybe even will. But even later this year, you know, Bethany and I have been talking about starting our own podcast that would be kind of more of an inspirational thing, be shorter, like so more of a, you know, like instead of 40, you know, to 45 minutes, uh something that's more of a 20-minute kind of thing. We haven't even like decided on the like if it's every week or is it like once a month or whatever. And I've even been personally thinking through some very short form content that could be inspiring, thought-provoking, helpful, that's you know, just like the little brief five-minute things for people. Again, like all as like there's lots of things, and I don't know, I I've spent my first five decades having lots of great thoughts and ideas that that I don't execute on or I forget about at some point. Like it was a great idea, and I'm like, if I could only remember that really cool thought that I had that I wanted to share with somebody and didn't write down, but these are some things that I just feel like have kind of been bubbling under the surface for long enough that you know, I'm just I I'm kind of passionate about thinking, how can I help people and how can I leave some things that might even continue to help people long after we're gone, you know? So yeah.

SPEAKER_03 20:17

Well, and what we've what we are creating and have created here is a platform for that, right? It is just a place for you know, all of those great ideas that you had and then forgot to find to find actualization in that. And, you know, I mean, one of the links I know we've we've put onto the website uh is uh, you know, I created a church health scorecard. And so you you can it'll take you to that place, and that place is uh, you know, owned or or you know, kind of overseen by the Converge Mid-Atlantic, whatever. But as a church talk project person, right, if you come to it through that, through our page, you can identify yourself that way. And it's still free, doesn't cost anything. And but it helps me then when I get reports that someone did the church scorecard. Man, I can reach out to you and I can hopefully, you know, offer you some resources or connect you to some resources uh based on you know the the way you are assessing your church and and where things are at.

SPEAKER_01 21:15

Yeah, that's so good. Lots of stuff.

SPEAKER_03 21:17

That's so good. So what what what I mean? We we're already halfway through the podcast just celebrating all the fun stuff that's going on and and so forth. I don't want this to be a huge commercial, although I guess that ship sailed.

SPEAKER_01 21:28

But well, well, it's really not a commercial in that like you know, a lot of things, it's funny, isn't it? Like a lot of things are like, here's this great free content, but then the then the next step is so buy this thing. Right. And uh and you know, and I again there there are things I'm sure that we we will offer and maybe even do offer. I mean, we have actually gone and interacted with churches, you know, and helped coach and train and inspire and whatever. And obviously, we can't like travel and you know do all that stuff. stuff just always on our own nickel or for free. But, you know, I mean, so yeah, I'm not I'm the this isn't a promise that nothing will ever, you know, be like a pay thing. But when you say go take the church health scorecard and then I can connect you with resources, that's not a bait and switch. That's not a then for $99.95, you can, you know, uh like literally this is because we want to encourage, equip, and engage with pastors and leaders. And if we can, you know, help and resource like we we're doing that.

SPEAKER_03 22:29

Yeah. And and there are things that you and I do that, you know, we we will have to charge something for just to cover the expense of it. And you know, I just did a big vision thing with the nonprofit, which was, you know, fun. It was great. But I mean there was a cost to that because I I couldn't do my paying job because I was doing that job. So like you know we we do have to, you know, there will be times. But generally speaking, yeah, we're gonna do everything we can at no charge just because that's what we want to do. And if there is a charge it's just really to cover cost. It's not because we're trying to make you know I'm not gonna get rich off the church stock project. I'll tell you that right now.

SPEAKER_01 23:07

Well I I'm I'm sure not either.

SPEAKER_03 23:09

I know that from experience that's actually even if you do I'm still not that's I I wrote that into the bylaws. Rob cannot get if we had bylaws that would be funny. Yeah it would be it's still it's still a funny church joke. Well that's true. That's true. Hey so you were talking uh it was be I don't remember it was before we were before we were recording or after we were recording JC no you have to ask me the question first you were gonna ask me what my favorite part of all this was. I I was I was gonna get to that after but that's okay we'll start with that question.

SPEAKER_01 23:46

No no I like it let's let's go with that I don't want to go to the deep end of the pool and then come back and then come back to the shallow yeah okay well so Rob my my dear friend and co-host what is your favorite part about doing this podcast that's that's a great question and honestly like I there's not any part of it that I don't like or you know like like oh guy we got to do another one of those you know like right right which is kind of fun right in almost four years there's just like there's not been any of that uh which is cool. So beyond kind of the mission right that we really do care about the local church and and pastors and you know high level volunteers and leaders in local churches and we want to just help them and encourage them and and those kinds of things. I would say the two things I love the most are when we have had guests almost across the board the the kingdom heart of the people that we have gotten to meet and interview has just been mind blowing. You know like we don't maybe there's been a few but like we really don't uh bump into people who are really out for like their own gain. They really do want to serve and help you know the local church uh way more than any personal benefit. And that's just been very encouraging because I think in a world where everybody's kind of trying to do their own thing and out for their own thing, you know, that's different. And then I mean we talk about this all the time. You and I do privately off camera. We even talk about it you know in episodes but you know you and I are are good friends. We're really close friends and so just getting to hang out with each other for an hour every week in this way um that also serves the greater good is yeah it's just a joy to do.

SPEAKER_03 25:38

Yeah yeah I I agree for me you know I would say what you said yes you know like it's and and especially the part about I mean there are a couple things on my end that I'm like but it's things like I gotta edit or I gotta make sure the upload happened right. I mean it's stupid stuff like that right it's not it's just you know it's that administrative stuff that I was never good at anyway but you know that but beyond that I love like talking shop right I I just enjoy talking shop with you with other you know the guests that we brought in for a couple reasons one I just enjoy but two it sharpens me like I I I actually it gets me thinking about how we lead why we lead what do we do what is shepherding actually looks like how do we take care of ourselves in the midst of this what are the things like it just it just engages my brain on a level that you know sitting around watching TV doesn't do you know like I mean like I I get to actually be part of something and and and guide some conversations toward things and I you know you talked about the guest and stuff I we've made some good friends just from having them on the podcast. I mean a few weeks ago I was standing in Louisville Kentucky chatting with Mitch Harrison our new friend from Las Vegas that like I mean we just hung out for a while because we're friends now and we're introducing each other to people and it was just it's like wow I mean a what how does something and that all happened I think we connected with a podcast promoting something or another that was trying to get Mitch onto podcast to do for his book and I mean it's random total and and yet it ends up we both have some old mutual friends and it it was kind of cool. But I just love that opportunity to meet new friends uh in that way. And I think the last thing I would say that really man this just makes me I just love this is I love hearing from people pastors that heard an episode and it just touched them. It encouraged them it, you know, there's something about and it doesn't it's not that I had to be the one to say something or you did like we could have had a guest on and they're just like man when that guy or that lady talked it just I something clicked and I was like I get it now. Man when I get to hear reports like that I get an email or a phone call or run into somebody and they that just makes my day you know I just I love that.

SPEAKER_01 28:09

And and just to reflect on what you said for a second, you know, like I I'll just speak for me like I don't necessarily I don't lack confidence you know I don't like walk around moping through life like oh I could never do that. But I think for both of us like we don't care. We don't need credit you know we approach this with with earnest humility like it doesn't need to be my idea it doesn't need you know we don't need to benefit like if we can serve people like so yeah I I I love that help thing too. I also you know in terms of connecting with people it's funny I like because you know I mean heck we loved what Mitch was doing so much you bought some books for some pastors in our area and sent those out my church did a whole series this year and we bought cases of books. So you know we just loved and believed in Mitch so much that we and he again has been super generous with us so that you know like and we have tried to support what he's up to as well. So that that's just like a super super fun thing to be able to do and hey remind me what was your first one again that you said the first of the three I just talking shots and so I I think sometimes like and I even I I said this I think in the episode that's gonna drop next week where it's like you know like I go on vacation for a couple days and all we talked about as a family is church stuff and ministry stuff. And sometimes that can sound like a complaint or a but no it's like that's our whole life right like church and ministry is like our entire life heck my family last week was at a numerous day in a row every four years, every quadrennium a business meeting for my former denomination where they can bring memorials and debate them and vote on them to change the book of discipline for the denomination right like all the rules and bylaws and whatever that they follow. And like who do you know other than people like you and me who would literally drive to a different state and literally spend like four days listening to and being excited about hearing and and like being engaged in all the discussion and debate and disagreement and whatever for the stuff that's gonna wind up in the there's 9,000 different you know things 7,082 subsection four or whatever right like yeah and it's like but yeah I mean I'm with you man like that that kind of stuff like I care about that and I I like talking about it and thinking about it. And the cool thing is if you if we just do it by ourselves like that's one thing and that's okay. But I know for me like sometimes I don't know what to think or I'm stuck somewhere and I can walk into the office and get like gather my staff and say hey help me to think this through and almost always like when I'm stuck 10 15 minutes 30 minutes later you know it could be a sermon or sermon series. It's like I don't know where to go with this one guys and and we brainstorm a little bit and I tell you what like it doesn't take too long with some people sitting around the table to get some gold and I I feel like it's fun when we do that it's fun when we do that with guests but in a broader sense when people are tuning in and listening they're kind of part of that talking shop and thinking these thoughts with us. And like you always say send us an email right like let's engage together in this conversation.

SPEAKER_03 31:36

Yeah yeah I agree and it you know to to swim down towards the deep end for just a minute you know you you were talking and and again it was off camera but but you you we're talking about and we're probably going to bring this up in another episode soon but this guy that you that you listened to and he was talking about some things but ultimately when a leader at that church is even in kind of engaging in some stuff that maybe is uh it can push the envelope in a lot of ways we we a couple years ago did our workshop called Poke the Bear right there are times when you say some things that might sound a little provocative or sound a little you know challenging to people and a lot of times people get upset because it's a social issue. And yet the one thing that you got to keep coming back to when you are talking about these things, when you are pushing the envelope a little bit ultimately it has you your job as a pastor and and leader in in the church is to make sure you are always making it all about Jesus and and and as long as you keep coming back to that then you know you're gonna be on good footing. That doesn't mean everyone's gonna agree with you. But and and I think you had an experience in this even recently right where you you were basically teaching scripture I mean whoo that's a crazy thought right crazy but you got pushback from that I don't know do you want to share just a little bit I don't you can go as deep as you want on it but yeah yeah yeah and actually but let me say listen let me say something first before we kind of go because that's you know uh that's kind of the drowning end of the pool.

SPEAKER_01 33:13

And you know I I can still tippy toe touch kind of where you just took us you know I I I want to kind of caution our listeners because you know hearing something like this it's kind of like uh a friend of mine was when he was younger went to an Andy Stanley thing and you know and Andy was like you know hey you know like you need to get to the point where you're doing like your main thing and not doing all these other things and there's this like whatever 23 year old youth pastor who was there with his pastor and on the way home the 23 year old was like yeah that's why I don't want to do this this this this this this and this that you have on my job description I only want to do and it's like you know the whatever 50 year old senior pastor had to kind of smack his youth guy around a little bit and say hey listen like yes like you need to work that direction but what we pay you for is that list of things and you can like you know either go start your own thing and just do the one thing and and figure it out see how that works you're gonna work here right so so this whole idea of it's all about Jesus and make it all about Jesus that's not just something you can slap as a bumper sticker on the end of the thing you want to do. Yes and and and you know what like even though it is all about Jesus that doesn't mean that you know some of the things that Jesus might be up to and even sort of leading you to do aren't going to create deep hurt pain that people won't leave your church or minister. You know like that could that could and will still be part of the experience. It doesn't mean that everything will be blessed and up into the right and uh yeah I I think that this is just so important because for so many of us we do the things that we want to do or we are wired to do. We make it all about us. Right. That never works well. No sometimes we make it all about our denomination or our you know kind of theological bent on secondary issues that becomes what we make it all about and all of those things really like destroy churches. I know a lot of people oh no like we need our theological underpinnings absolutely you do. But when you make secondary issues and your theological perspective on them like a hill that you die on I'm telling you I've watched it over and over again it will literally blow churches up. Yeah so so you know let's make it all about Jesus let's put him as the only hill we're willing to die on and from there we we figure everything else out. So yeah let me tell you my little uh my little story so a couple weeks ago we made an announcement that we are actually this summer hiring our first church planter in residence. For 15 years we have articulated that like our mission is to multiply spaces where people can come as they are encounter Jesus and leave different and we mean that in like every way possible so we want to multiply small groups and we want to play multiply ministry spaces and all those things like all the all the small stuff too but we also want to multiply churches you know where where people literally can come be loved be welcomed you know no matter where they're coming from but creating space where they can actually encounter the real Jesus making it all about him and leave different and we've had a lot of things that have kept us from doing that. We've had some debt that we had to retire we paid off uh you know a number of years ago now all of our mortgages and then obviously wanting to work with the right people we don't just want to like put a a thing out on the internet and have someone say yeah I'd love to have you pay me tens of thousands of dollars a year to do ministries so I'll I'll just come and do like we wanted to make sure that was right. So we we made that announcement and uh and like super exciting right like we're finally leaning heavily into the thing that like this is kind of what we want to do and what we feel God has made us to do and what we've done you know some of in our in our past. So so that's one week literally the next week one week later we have someone who shows up at our church and the next day posts a thing on I don't even know this human being. I've never seen them or met them ever but apparently they're at my church you know that next week and listen to my sermon and had a lot of good things to say leading up to the sermon but then you know I I basically became the example of why we're in the end times and I'm one of those preachers that like will just give people's you know uh whatever tickling ears the tickle the ears of people and just give them what they want and uh and everybody of my church is gay and a liberal democrat. All because I really pressed into the idea that you know like for us like we kind of want to like hate our enemies that's a very normal thing. You've heard it said Jesus says right in the Sermon on the mount you've heard it said love your neighbor and hate your enemy right and and and it's very honestly it's very easy uh I'll even I'll just say it personally for me to do that. It's easy for me to love people who love me and treat me well. It's easy for me to want to kind of hate people who don't and who treat me poorly right but what does Jesus say but I say to you love your enemy and pray for those who persecute you and uh it's like oh and then even some of that following text right about hey listen if you only love those who love you like even the worst people on the planet do that right even the pagans even the uh tax collectors they they do that like you're no different than any of the people who are trying to be different than and better than if that's where your love stops so so yeah this person went out and said all these horrific things about me and and New Hope and uh and that same Sunday it was a it was uh Memorial Day weekend so we you know a lot of people playing baseball and out but we still had a great good attendance but we had one of like the lowest offerings I can ever remember. And I'm like so within seven days Jason of yes we're finally doing this you know there's like this real blatant attack which we have all responded with with either nothing or with love. And because I think we weren't fighting um within 24 hours he pulled his thing down anyway. So that I mean I think that's maybe good. But you know and then you know it's like hey like this people have been stepping up and finances have been strong and then the week after we say this like we had this huge kind of dip tank kind of week.

SPEAKER_03 39:42

And I'm sure it's just an Yeah it was a perfect storm too in in from that I mean just as the guy who's run the finances for a church before you know it was a it was a fourth Sunday which is typically lower but it was the fourth of five Sundays because May has five Sundays and it was a holiday weekend and it's the end of the school year and like I mean there's all these reasons yes you know that and and not that you are looking for reasons but I'm saying like but it's still every time and I've run into this the same way right we announce this amazing thing that God is doing right and we're gonna step out in faith the very next week you have ample excuses to walk it back and say wait maybe God didn't want us to because the offering wasn't there or this wasn't there or now I've got to rethink it or and and really it becomes in a way are you making this about Jesus or are you making it about your own comfort and your own security yeah and that's a tough one.

SPEAKER_01 40:45

It is because we have an enemy right we have an enemy that when we like are willing to like you said step out in faith and risk something big we have an enemy who's like I don't want those people who are going to be reached by what they do to be reached. I don't want people to like grow and and you know trust God more. So yeah I mean if our enemy can actually do the enemy type things and derail that and and so I I I wanted to say that not so that uh like our listeners would go oh poor Rob and like they could pray for me. Although if you want to that I will totally take prayers from anyone all the time. But I just wanted you guys to hear this. It's not like Jason and I are like sitting on the other side of like all of these like learnings and life and battles and whatever as the sages who you know everything's just up into the right for us and we've got it all figured out like I just want you to hear like we understand in very real ways the need for people who serve and lead in local churches for engagement equipping and in particular sometimes just some encouragement. Yes we get gut punched on the regular you know because we're trying to make it all about Jesus and serve him well. So so what we're offering or attempting to offer to all of you as our listeners is something that we just know how important these things are. And uh and so yeah we just want to be a part of that.

SPEAKER_03 42:13

Yes and we are so glad that you would even take time you know each week to to listen to our ramblings and our for 200 weeks now. For 200 oh my goodness that is crazy I'm gonna have to add some sound effects every time we say 200 I don't know what it'll be it'll probably be inappropriate so I probably won't do it. But we are just honored and we love doing this and we love uh all the people who reach out and and talk with us and uh we would love to hear from any and all of you. So take a moment if you don't mind and shoot us an email shoot us a text whatever it is we would appreciate it. And of course it helps us if you do take a minute and like and subscribe and all that you know share the podcast and now starting later this week you'll be able to check it out on YouTube and share it from there. And who knows maybe seeing our faces will just change the landscape of the church talk project like it might shut it down. Or it might everyone goes wow even they can do what if they can then surely I can and that's what I'm hoping happens.

SPEAKER_00 43:20

So to all of our listeners man have an amazing week we are so excited thank you for 200 episodes that is that is a gift to us as well and we appreciate it and we will talk to you next week thanks for joining us today at the Church Talk Podcast we hope the conversation encouraged and challenged you we would love to hear from you email your questions or comments to Jason at churchtalkproject dot com. The Church Talk Podcast with Rob and Jason is brought to you by the Church Talk Project we work to engage equip and encourage pastors and church leaders around the world Thanks for listening.