Living On Purpose

In this episode, Rob and Jason explore the importance of living intentionally, managing busyness, and prioritizing meaningful relationships and purpose. They share personal stories, practical tips, and reflections on how to live life on purpose despite life's distractions.

 resources

Full Focus Planner - https://fullfocusplanner.com/

Church Talk Project Website - https://churchtalkproject.com/

Chapters

00:00 Introduction and Podcast Overview
01:53 Updates on Church Talk Project and Partnerships
05:38 Navigating Busy Seasons in Ministry
10:11 Reflecting on Life's Priorities
14:22 The Importance of Presence and Relationships
18:03 Embracing Life's Tensions and Uncertainties
20:32 The Power of Time and Consistency
26:46 Living on Purpose vs. Living for the Moment
30:03 The Importance of Connection and Relationships
34:53 Planning for Progress and Embracing Imperfection

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Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Hey everybody, welcome back to the Church Talk Project with Rob and Jason. We are so glad that you took some time to uh download and hopefully you take a moment and subscribe and share to the podcast because I mean we we really don't do any advertising. I was actually talking with a guy yesterday who like he does marketing for this type thing for a living. And he's like, wait, you don't like pay for any marketing or anything? I was like, no, this is all just word of mouth. And he's like, and you still have people listening? I was like, hey, our tens of listeners love us.

SPEAKER_02 0:35

You know, as you say that, though, the funny thing is when I'm listening to and or watching like a podcast or a longer YouTube video, and then you know, there's the whatever, one time or three times the word from our sponsor or the video or whatever pops up, and I have to watch that. I'm telling you, like there are times where that's where I just like stop it, tune out, click off, you know, all those kinds of things. And I don't know, like you and I don't really have, you know, this master plan going forward. Uh, so I'm not saying we'd never do that. And actually, we've had we had we have we had kind of one, you know, sponsor at one point uh that because we loved their service and and we actually utilized them, so we talked about it, but you know, I don't know. I don't know. I just I have all kinds of different ways I feel about stopping the conversation to play a little video, you know, in exchange for so a quick update.

SPEAKER_01 1:27

I mean, this is episode 199, and so our next episode will be episode 200. And, you know, we've got big plans. Okay, no, we don't actually have anything planned for it yet, but we will before we record it. But here's the thing I want to say is I am in the midst of updating the churchtalkproject.com website. But like we've got, we are connecting and partnering with a couple of organizations uh that are you know affiliates that we're gonna have links on the website. You know, we've had Regan Van Stinis on the show uh a couple of times. She's a church law strategy uh heart for the local church is just awesome.

SPEAKER_02 2:07

I mean, she brings lots of experience and skill, but you know, and then uh, you know, with with so many of our guests and now our partners, you know, I mean, just people who have a heart for the church is just it's amazing.

SPEAKER_01 2:20

And you can go to our website now and and link to her and you can find out about the subscription stuff that they have for very affordable legal counsel. And I'm in the process of getting chemistry staffing on our website because I'm technically a church coach for them, which can get you connected to them and get some discounts if your church needs help and staffing support and finding stuff. Uh, you know, we've got several other that I'm in the process of of getting that in. And again, we're just doing it because it takes you to a partner that we trust and and that we've worked with. And, you know, our our goal has been since day one, right, Rob, to you know, engage equipment, empower pastors and leaders around the world. And so if it's through the website, if it's through the podcast, and I I I really think I I've got a plan now. We are gonna launch the YouTube channel. Hopefully after 200 episodes, I've got a plan and I have everything lined up and it'll you'll be able to go back and see some of our old, older, you know, podcast uh episodes. But I I think it's gonna be uh it's kind of cool. I you know, we're we're at a season where we're just seeing some things come together and and it's kind of fun.

SPEAKER_02 3:27

Yeah, that's cool. You know, so Jason, I need to I, you know, I don't I don't like this. I don't like doing this, I don't like when it's done to me, but you said engage, equip, and empower. And we are three are engage, equip, and encourage. Yes. Which, you know what, like actually points something out that I think we should discuss here at the start of this podcast episode, which is, you know, someone might be listening in and they're like, oh man, we uh we had this happen one time where like somebody who came to our church, it was like one of those child sponsorship things, they had their own video that we played, and then that video went on our our YouTube channel, and some like malicious lawyer out of New York figured out that that like 10 second clip of a song that wasn't even in our video, but that was played on our YouTube channel was um you know uh a copyrighted thing. And so uh we got sued, and uh, and I could go on and on with that. But like and for like we and Jeremy, uh one of my staffers, reached out to this, like in good faith to say, hey, like we pulled it down, like we'll do it. And they're like, Yeah, send us money, and then we'll like turn the other cheek. And and and you know, we're like, what? You know, and and it then it occurred to us like, oh my gosh, we have you know uh insurance. So we called our insurance agent, and they're like, Oh yeah, and they helped us and it was fine. But you know what, like there might be someone listening into us, something like that, or some other legal thing, and they heard you mention Reagan and her subscription services, and they're like, that might really be an affordable way we can help get some some counsel or some advice. And then, you know, there might be a this maybe the same pastor listening and is like, I've really like been searching for like the last eight months and haven't haven't made any progress for this children's pastor we need to hire for a youth person, and and so maybe we should reach out, you know, life just life has this way of you know, like we all have like 25 things we're trying to figure out in some way, shape, or form. You know, we have job stuff, we have family stuff, we have I mean, you know, it just all comes crashing in. I think so many of us are so busy, and just managing all that becomes a real challenge, you know. Like, I mean, like you've been in a busy season.

SPEAKER_01 5:38

Yeah, yeah. No, I have, and it's not all bad, right? It's not like I'm busy with bad stuff, it's just there's a lot going on. Uh, you know, traveling and managing uh stuff at home, uh, you know, just having kids, right? You know, even though they're out of the house and older, there's still stuff to manage. There, there's, you know, there's the the stuff with Converge that that I'm doing that is just, you know, it's taking up some time right now, which is it's good. I mean, I'm I'm sitting in in the office of a pastor in Love It Town. The illustrious Ross. Yes. We have had both Ross and his wife Emily on the podcast. And at the very end of the podcast, when you hear that lovely lady do the little outro stuff, that is the one and only Emily Manders. So I am I'm just sitting here absorbing the greatness. Although if you could look around, it's kind of funny because Ross is a he like he always has some project that he's doing. And he even told me he wants to start a new business called Mediocre, uh, Mediocre Handyman, like something like that, because he's like, I'll get it done. It's not gonna be great, it's gonna be done and acceptable. It's the opposite of John Sanders. Yes, yes. So I'm looking around. I mean, his office, it's literally packed with boxes in front of his bookcases of storage things that haven't aren't, you know, just got from the storage or going back to the storage, and it's a total mess, and I love it.

SPEAKER_02 7:01

Yeah. But yeah, and so, you know, you you talk about like your busyness. Um, you know, I have kind of alluded to I've kind of been in a busy season from just before Christmas to really almost Mother's Day, and then some things kind of fell off my schedule, and I'm like, okay, I'm finally there. And then I realized that there were a couple weddings I had coming up that um, you know, just due to like not only my own busyness, but the also the the couples, um, you know, we we were kind of short sheeted in terms of uh having the all the requisite uh premarital counseling sessions in uh and and so um trying to force those in. Um and actually in the next couple weeks, I have two weddings. Uh a week from now I have a wedding, and then the next week I have a wedding. Uh and so in my head, you know, I'm doing what you what we all always do. It's like as soon as I get through that, yeah, then, you know, then my life actually does. Although it was so funny, this week I spent five days in Indiana. My oldest son flew back in from a Mayterm class, so we had to pick him up, which we were a little closer to him, uh, just where we were. You know, I mean, you can just go on and on. I mean, there's just thing after thing. We get back the next day. Um, he had an MRI, so I spent a whole bunch of time yesterday. Next week, we got to go back up to have the results from that, you know. And I think like, you know, the the broader point that I want to make here, and I heard this thing, I don't know, maybe maybe as much as 10 years ago now, Michael Hyatt, you know, asked the question, you know, when you think about your life, like think about the last 10 years, you know, have you like literally lived 10 years of life, made 10 years of progress and whatever? Or have you just lived the same year over and over again 10 times? And I still remember it because those words like gripped my heart. Because if I was being honest, you did we just, you know, we just get caught up in the pace of life. If you're in ministry, you know that. All right, we got Christmas, we got Easter, we got, you know, Mother's Day, we got baptisms, we you know, I mean, like there's just like the things that you do and you keep doing them over and over. And everybody knows I don't, you know, Sunday comes every week, right? So like there's another sermon to preach. Yeah. I just wish twice a year, you know, we just take Sunday off twice a year, you know, like so things just keep happening. And like you said, like with travel and and just your workload, nothing, it's not bad stuff, right? Like, we're not saying that, but like for how many of us do we say, I've always wanted to do this, I've always wanted to go there. You know, someone said, Hey, who for you are like the priorities in your life? You might give a list of people, some of whom maybe you haven't really even talked to or interacted with or sat down with for like a year or two or five or you know, whatever. So we say things, we even believe them to be true, but for so many of us, we just let life happen to us instead of like, you know, seizing control of the agency that we do have and say, listen, I'm out of shape, I've been out of shape for way too long, I know I'm busy, but you know what? I'm gonna get my lazy butt out of bed and I'm gonna go for like a mile walk or two mile walk or a three-mile walk every morning. And I don't care if it's 90 because it's like summertime, or if it's like rainy, or if it's snowing, I'm gonna go for a walk, right? Like again, you know, whatever it is, or you know what? Like my spouse and I are so stinking busy, we don't remember the last time we just had a conversation about, hey, how are you? Whatever, like every single week, you know, whether we can afford it, whether we have the time, you know what, this is the priority. So we're gonna have a date night, you know, like actually saying we're gonna take a little more control and stop letting life happen to us and start living our lives a little more.

SPEAKER_01 10:54

Yeah. I mean, we we were joking before I hit record that we talk a big game about getting together and playing golf and doing all this stuff. But I mean, if you look at the calendar the last six months, the only time we've really been together and doing stuff is usually related to Converge or working or you know, like it's not just we got together and hung out. I mean, you know, the like I don't remember if it was two weeks ago, whenever it was, you you texted me and said, Hey, I'm driving through Delaware to pick something up. Do you want to meet up? And we did for, you know, up in eight minutes. Like, I mean, it wasn't a big hang, but like we just, and I know Pilot, yes, we live just over an hour away from each other. It's not like it's, you know, I'm not, I'm not on the way to anything, and neither are you. So like we we only get together when we make the time and schedule it and do it. And I gotta be honest, like, I I don't, I can't remember a time that we did that that I regretted it, right? That I was like, oh, I could have used that time better. I mean, even if I could have used it more productive in something else, spending time with a friend that I that I love and care for outweighed anything I could have gotten done, you know, in some other arena. And I do think we forget.

SPEAKER_02 12:03

Yeah. You know, I've been thinking about this differently, and this kind of gets us maybe a step closer to, you know, what we want to talk about today, which were we're in many ways already talking about it. You know, it was uh a number of weeks ago, and I may have mentioned this, but I think it's even if I did it, it bears repeating. You know, there was a guy, awesome guy, you know, he and his wife attended my church for a long time until his health really failed to the point where he needed to move into kind of more of an assisted living, nursing home kind of style place. And but, you know, like every Sunday they were greeters, you know, and he always just had this, you know, fun, ornery smile on his face. And even when his he got shaky on his feet, his mobility started to fail more, you know, like just you know, kind of doing his best to come and to, you know, use his his walker or whatever to get in. You know, I mean, just a great, great guy. And then he went into like an assisted living place and uh he passed away um not too long ago. I actually uh did his uh funeral. He just wanted his wishes, were just a graveside, which was uh a beautiful, beautiful time. Um, and it was great to, you know, see um some of the family that I hadn't seen for a while. But you know, leading up to that, I was reflecting on it and I'm like, you know, when Lester went into um the nursing home, um, I never saw him. Like I saw him on social media or whatever, but it's like in that and that was like years of time. And I I would honestly say, like, I had the best of intentions to like see him, but life just got busy, and then all of a sudden, like, you know, and and and his family was great, and they were even like, hey, listen, we got this, you know, you don't need to, like, you know, there was no there was no, hey, would you please come and I didn't come kind of moment, but it doesn't matter, you know, like as as somebody who's like, hey, this guy was a part of us, and you know, I I I love the guy and uh it was a great person, and I would have loved to just go hang out with him for an hour and sit and talk and pray and whatever. And then and then I don't have the chance anymore, and I look back and I go, you know, like how is it that we're all so stinking busy doing all the things that, you know, in a year's window of time, we we can't prioritize a visit or two with somebody.

SPEAKER_01 14:22

Yeah, yeah. I I don't remember if I said this out loud before or not, but I, you know, I someone said, I think it was Reggie McNeil, said to me that if you stop and think of a year of your life, like the next 365 days, right? How do you want to spend that year? And the question isn't like big dream, vision, purpose, like like if you how many days do you want to be on the road? How many days do you want to be at home? How many day, you're like, and think of it in terms of a year block, not a week, not a yeah, you know, not a schedule, but how many days do you want to be away from your family? Okay. Is it, you know, however many, whatever number that is that fits with the rhythm of everything, put a lid on it and then say no after that. And you know, I'm like, oh, I never, I didn't think of it that way. And that has really started me rethinking the way I plan my schedule, the way it, you know, and so I I I like that. And and uh, you know, there's a tension that that I think we feel, and and this tension really came to a head to me honestly yesterday afternoon. Uh I had just finished two days of strategic planning meetings with our regional staff and all this stuff, and it was good, positive, you know, all the stuff. I get in the car and my phone rings, and it's another church strengthening guy from another region, a good friend of mine. Yeah, you know, we we've worked together on several things, and he shares some news with me about a dear friend, uh mentor of both of us that is, you know, and by the time this podcast comes out, you know, it I'm not sharing anything that hasn't already been shared publicly, but you know, he he's the national director of church strengthening. So a guy for the last five years has been a big part of my life. And uh yesterday morning, he walked out of his house and had a heart attack and died on his driveway and out of the blue. I mean, they literally, the moving truck is coming the next day to move him and his wife to another state where they are going to be living right next to their brand new grandbaby. Like they are moving into a section of life, a season of life that they were excited about. It was, you know, and I just remember just on the phone, I honestly I told the guy who called me, I was like, Andrew, you're you're joking, right? I mean, I kept waiting for Bruce, this guy to laugh in the background and say, I gotcha, you know, but it never came. And I ended up making another call and all the stuff. And I was, I mean, I'm still I still in shock, kind of, uh, just because it's so out of the blue. But but I really started thinking about and writing down some things of just the tension that we live in of planning for the future, right? I mean, we we as pastors, we have to plan for the future. We make all these long-term and even short-term plans, but also embracing each moment in a way that is I'm truly present with the people I'm with. You know, I'm not thinking about what's next. I'm not, and you know, it's not that you should do one over the other. It's how do you live into that tension of saying, I need to do both, but I also need to remember to hold loosely to my plans, my dreams, even my stuff, right? You know, because they could be gone and embrace what I have right in front of me. And I don't, I mean, I know we we've done enough funerals between our listeners and us that we've probably said that, you know, but yeah, it's way harder to live. Yeah, it did. It just smacked me in the face last night and even in today.

SPEAKER_02 18:03

Yeah, and I and Jason, I think that, you know, just what you shared, you know, is so important because everything that was said by you and me up until that moment, you know, I know this. And we have we've done this, we've talked about things like this, you know, in in pastors' meetings. And there's always the one, or even, you know, in some ways, maybe all of us who give the pushback. Yeah, that sounds great. But, you know, as soon as I make this higher, then I'll be able to give all that stuff up, then my life will be manageable, then I'll be less busy, right? But the problem with that is there's like you can even execute those things, and then there's I didn't foresee this, there's one more thing I gotta do, and there's there's always one more thing, right? But you know, for all of us, you hear kind of this more I what sounds like idealistic sort of talking and scheduling and planning and stuff, and you roll your eyes and you go, Yeah, I tried that about like 25 times and it never really worked. And so, you know, I I like the word tension because it's always tension, but I'd rather not have any extra tension in my life, so I'm just gonna let my life live me, and when I'm done, I'm done, right? And we say those things tongue in cheek, but then you have a moment where somebody, you know, really uh not much older than you and I, um, who, you know, by all appearances was significantly healthier than you and I, is no longer with us, you know, and it really sort of creates a like a moment of pause and reflection, which it should, where we're like, man, like if I knew a week from now or a month from now or a year from now, you know, no matter what I did, you know, my life was gonna come to an end. What are the things I'm doing? Who are the people that I'm spending my time with? What's the that one you know place that I have always wanted to see that I'm gonna go to? You know, like how am I gonna interact with my spouse and my kids more intentionally in ways that leave, you know, an even more significant lasting impact? You know, what heck, well, you know, um, how am I gonna prepare financially? You know, like what kind of insurance anybody ever done this where you're like, oh, I really do need to get some life insurance at some point, but you know, I'm a little heavy, and so I'll be paying an extra premium to do that. So I'm just gonna wait till I lose this much weight, which maybe you do, maybe you don't. And so like it's just a never-ending thing. And then, you know, you're not here, and then what is it, what happens to your your loved ones that you have not left well? You know, like there's just all the things.

SPEAKER_01 20:34

It is, it really is. Um, it got me thinking too, you know, about the idea that, and you kind of touched on this when you talked about the 10 years. Did I live a decade, or did I just live 10, one? One year 10 times, yeah. Yeah. Um, it really got me thinking about we often overestimate what we can accomplish in a day or a week, but we underestimate what we can accomplish in a year or even a decade. And so we we get we try to get all this done today, but we forget that the faithful showing up and doing the things that are in front of you over time actually have a much bigger cumulative effect than that one big project that we thought we could get done. I I was in the the strategic planning meetings that we were in for the last couple of days. The thing that we were supposed to do, that we were being forced to do, was to evaluate all the things we are doing and then look at it and go, okay, now in order to do the things that you want to do moving forward, you have to eliminate 20% of this in some way, shape, or form. If you're gonna have margin to actually add anything else to this. And if you actually believe in what you want to do moving forward, we gotta what are you gonna cut? What are you gonna stop doing? Or or hand off, or you know, that it's not that you have to eliminate it and therefore it's no longer a thing, but but you've got to. figure out a way that you're not the one doing it. And that was really hard because I don't do stuff that I don't think is important. And yet when I pull back and look at the cumulative, you know, effect of things, it's like, well, was it really that important? And was I doing it because I just wanted to do something like that? Or was I doing it because it was actually helping us move the needle, you know, in the important areas?

SPEAKER_02 22:33

And I think this is one of those things in the local church too. And I'll just like, I'm, I'll caricaturize it and make it sound funny, but but it's real. It's real, right? Like so for some for some of us, we do things because, well, I know only, you know, four people or three people or one person comes to that prayer meeting. But if I stop doing that and it gets me back an hour of prep and an hour of being there and 30 minutes of conversation afterwards and then you know like you're literally getting back three hours of your week but you know that if you do, Mildred is going to be ticked because she is so faithful and that's like her favorite thing. And you know you just love Mildred so much because she is just a prayer warrior and she's just been like you know such a foundational piece of your church and you would just hate to do anything that would injure or harm her. But you know strategically speaking there are way better ways to you know mobilize prayer that'll have way more people praying than you showing up with that one person or a few people. And you know that your time does matter and that you could do things that are more valuable. But this is why like leadership as they say is a very lonely thing because sometimes like if someone came to you in a vacuum and just told you that you would go oh yeah you got to kill the prayer meeting like just no quit and do it nicely and you know maybe even take your time doing it so it doesn't seem like abrupt and rash and whatever. But yeah like you could use that time in a way better way even if it's just hey instead of getting five hours of sleep a night now you get like seven because you're not you know doing this one thing on this one day. But everybody knows that. But then like in our local context we have this history and these stories and these relationships that we're trying to like protect and grow and we know that some of these right decisions are going to have a negative impact at least for a season and it's really difficult to do that. It's really hard to execute on that. So like there's just tensions everywhere right because I mean it's it honestly it's way worse to wake up 10 years from now realizing you haven't made any progress in 10 years and you've just lived the same year over and over again. But this week on Tuesday morning when you're like you know you're like it would crush her so I'll just I'll just do it again. I'll just do it again. Yeah. And one more week turns into a decade pretty quick.

SPEAKER_01 25:01

Yeah. Yeah well and it's I I think it was oh my mind just went blank is the uh the atomic habits guy Scott was it Adam Scott or was it I don't remember I'm butchering that now but I could find the book faster than I know the author's name. Yeah um but I heard him speak and and think it was at the Global Leadership Summit a couple years ago and he and he talked about the idea of the problem is that if you if you're just wanting to get into shape or maybe you know lose a few pounds by changing your diet, if I change my diet today and I eat healthy today and it's not nearly as good as the greasy cheeseburger and the pizza, but I eat healthy today. Well it's not you're right. And and but I eat healthy today and I wake up tomorrow morning, I haven't lost the 10 pounds. So I have to make that decision every day for like six months before I really start to see a difference. And that means I've got to trust that eventually this will be better. You know and making decisions about how we use our time it slips into that same thing of I could yes I prioritize my friendship with Rob, but I really got to get this other thing done quick before I can schedule a time with him or I've got to get this, you know, and then I look back and I'm like oh my gosh we haven't played golf yet. You know or we haven't spent time together in in you know same thing happens with your spouse, right? It's just well I just one more meeting one more thing. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 26:27

And you look around and you're like trickier when they're like when you live in the same house because you you believe the lie that it's going to be super easy just to like well grab some time whenever because they're right here. And then you just weeks and months pass and sometimes years and you're like that person's become a stranger because we haven't grabbed any time.

SPEAKER_01 26:46

Right. Yeah. And that's I I think I'm gonna title this this episode Living on purpose you know because I I I feel like we need to move toward living on purpose not living for the moment not living for you know just the mundane and I think a lot of us honestly don't know what that purpose is. We haven't stopped long enough to really reflect and you know losing a friend you know like I'm experiencing right now, it's it makes you stop and say, okay, wait a minute why am I here? What is the purpose behind everything that I do? Do I have I ever even stopped long enough to think about it? You know, because now you start thinking hey at the end of my life everybody's gonna gather around my casket they're gonna maybe cry a little bit you know they're gonna tell some stories then they're gonna go back to church and eat potato salad like they're you know I mean their life will go on have I left anything of worth in in the people not not in some great accomplishment or you know what but I mean in the people that I spent time with are they better because I was with them and am I willing to actually stop and think about that.

SPEAKER_02 27:56

Yeah and as you're even saying that I'm thinking how little our busyness will leave behind to our kids and our spouse. And if anything what it will do is it will kind of encourage the same sort of mistakes in them. Now I'm not saying we don't want to give our kids a good work ethic we sure do. But when you're working work and work wisely and work hard and all the things but like don't have your life just be nonstop work and others like honestly like some of the biggest impact I've had in other people's lives and other people have had in my life is that you know like a 90 minute conversation sitting on a deck you know one evening like literally sharing so deeply and truthfully and honestly that you typically don't peel back that far with most people and like and and you like are speaking truth and life and encouragement into each other and sharing in ways that are very vulnerable but like like you know what I'm a little bit more hopeful now because I I didn't I didn't realize that like what I thought was really bad and it maybe is but it's kind of normal too but then we also talked about you know steps and things that that help and and take us to better places and you know what I mean like just like that kind of life and if we're if we're so busy doing this that and the next thing that we're not having those moments really ever we're missing out.

SPEAKER_01 29:30

Yeah. Yeah I don't even want to add to that because I think that's that's just yes that what you just said uh is so important.

SPEAKER_02 29:38

Uh so Jason I got I got a couple of things that you know as we've been talking so I'm remembering back to a wedding I did for a couple who actually she was pregnant. They were young they were getting married anyway but you know they got things a little bit out of order. And so one of the things that I said to them which I say to every couple before a wedding was you need to prioritize a weekly date night. And I know like sometimes we that sounds like overkill but if you don't prioritize a weekly one maybe you're like we'll do it every other week twice a month and you miss one of those it's like it's a month you know between like actually spending time with each other. And in general this is important and certainly as a brand new couple this is important and especially as a couple who starting out with a kid is super important, right? So and they like it was so funny they were like you know grandmas are so excited like this will be the easiest thing we have so much built-in babysitting you know whatever and it was their one year anniversary of their wedding that they were actually grabbing a bite with another friend in town and invited Bethany and I to the place so we we showed up and you know grabbed some food and and hung out with them for a little bit and uh and so I you know I typically have like go to questions I'm like hey tell me like you know what's been the the best thing about being married and what's been the most difficult thing. Their answer to the most difficult thing was hey remember when you told us we needed to prioritize a weekly date night and we oh yeah yeah yeah like this will be the it'll be so easy for us and they're like we we can hardly count on you know one hand how many of those we had because you were right it was so difficult in just the flow of life to actually execute on this right so so it is hard to just like have things that we'll try to do that and it doesn't happen. And like you said eating a eating healthy today eating the salad instead of the cheeseburger today doesn't impact things and I have talked to so many people now you have the stories where people changed their ways and like lost 20 pounds like in in a couple weeks and you just kind of roll your eyes or whatever. But for the most part like I know tons of people who literally were like you're going to completely cut this that and the next thing out you know we're we're gonna do this and we're gonna do it well and we're gonna do it complete. And it seemed like the like for the first number of months sometimes the first thing that happened wasn't progress it was like they stalled you know like oh yeah I lost a couple pounds and then boom and I'm I'm eating good I'm exercising I'm getting good rest I'm I'm hydrating well and uh and literally for months like the scale doesn't budge and some days it even ticks up a little bit and they're like I ate vegetables yesterday like what in the world is happening right now and so like you said like there's just this sometimes like I'm doing right things but it it feels like it seems like my life is worse and so I'm gonna like give up on that. Um and and I think that's the problem. And then just one other thought and we've talked about this before but I think it it bears repeating again you know I have for years used the full focus planner and and and it's not that that tool is is magic although you know I'm used to it and so I really enjoy it. But you know it encourages you like to have a yearly plan where you put you know kind of eight to ten goals bigger goals down in various categories of life and uh and then you track that. So like you build your days and your weeks around that and then every quarter you kind of and and when you're planning for the year you'll put down hey I'm gonna accomplish these two or three or whatever goals in the first quarter of the year second like you you can pick all this stuff. It's not you know like you get to pick and and then every quarter you know you have because uh it's it's a three month the each planner so and part of the genius of that is that you are reevaluating every quarter like your plan your goals because you you might go this was a goal but realistically I'm not getting this one done you know this year so I'm gonna let it drop off and then there may be other ones that come up that are priorities. You're like I need to get this done and you know so it's it's this constant reevaluation. And it's so funny because I'm like everybody else there are things that I'm overwhelmed by and I'm like I don't think I'm ever getting that done and I'm just I just want to give this like brief testimony to say that just writing stuff down and evaluating it for a few minutes every day, you know, maybe 15 minutes every week and you know maybe a few hours every quarter and giving myself a half day every year just to like prayerfully plan and put some goals down that I want to achieve has really helped me to accomplish way more things than I ever did. And I think it's just it's sort of like when you start living you're like I we spend more than we make I don't want to know so as long as the debit card keeps swiping I'm just gonna I'm not gonna look I don't want to look you know because I I don't I'm gonna be discouraged by that. You know what looking is a good idea knowing is a good idea so you know we just think well I'm not gonna do it anyway so why would I plan that? Plan it and your chances of success skyrocket.

SPEAKER_01 34:58

I want to add something to that a caveat in a way um because I'm a perfectionist and so you saying all of that I'm like okay I have to when I take that half day to plan my next year and all this I've got to get those plans exactly perfect so that it's gonna be a perfect year. You know? And and my caveat is hey do something even if you do change it like because you are not going to get it perfect the first time. It it you're gonna do this for five years and it's gonna be you know it's a seven out of 10 the first year it's a seven and a half out of 10 the second year it's an eight out of 10, you know, like it's never going to be a 10 out of 10 in the way you know when you look back but in the same breath not doing it is a zero out of 10. So yes, you know something is better than nothing and progress is better than perfection usually because we can't we can't get perfection. And so I would 100% as a guy who I know if you told me that and I had never done it before my first thought I even felt myself thinking it as you were talking right it was crap I better get that one exactly right or I'm just gonna the whole year I'll be screwed and I I won't you know no no no no no the practice of doing it is as important as the things that you write down. Yeah yeah and that's what that I just I don't know I just felt like people need to hear that of and yeah I just thinking through all of that I think is so important for people to to even stop long enough to think through that.

SPEAKER_02 36:32

Yeah I heard Ramsey say this the other day he said you know you got like do your budget do it every month do it with your spouse and he and he said if you're just starting you're gonna it's gonna you're gonna it's gonna be terrible like you know you're gonna be like why are we even doing this? We forgot that we we totally you know put too much there we put not enough there you know whatever he goes it's gonna take you three months of doing this in order to even be remotely good at it so so they might not even be a seven out of ten they might be a four out of ten. Yes you know when they start planning things but four out of ten is way better than zero out of ten like you said. And uh this is so funny I was having a conversation the other day with my mother-in-law who was talking about now at almost 70 she just started to journal she'd never had the like I even tried the practice of journal I don't even know she was aware of it um and so she's been starting to do this and she's a perfectionist I'm a perfectionist too right like I have a hard time starting things if I don't feel like I can do them really really really well and imperfections just like they stand out to me and they drive me nuts. Like there's we probably need to be on some medication. Maybe we can get a buy one get one kind of deal from somebody. But she was saying that she was like the thing I have the hardest time with in journaling and she's just started doing this practice. She's like I I write and then I realize I misspelled a word so I rip that entire page out of my journal and I like which is a whole different level of perfectionism right and I I just sort of smiled and I said well first of all like the only way you build the muscle of journaling is by journaling. So you're not going to be good at it until you've done it for a while. And maybe that maybe seeing that misspelled word on the page even that you crossed out and wrote like you res like and you're like I hate that that's there. I'd prefer to rip this out and write the whole thing again like I'm not even that you know whatever. But I'm like maybe this is how God wants to sort of reinforce that he loves you even though you're not perfect. You know and she just she actually there was kind of this pregnant pause in the conversation and she said that is exactly what God has been trying to teach me. And it's really hard for me to you know but you know you gotta do it. And I mean to our to our listeners to man leaders in the local church pastors in the local church you would never you would never want that person in your church to stay stuck year after year. You would never want that person in your church not to take some steps and try some things because they couldn't be perfect. And so you know what we need to be and to become better examples to our people and just to the people in our communities and in our lives of what living life on purpose looks like. And as we set an example and as we progress they'll be like hey how did you do that? And that'll create a beautiful opportunity for even more of those kinds of conversations and interactions that are really transformative.

SPEAKER_01 39:44

Yeah. And we'd love to hear from our listeners how they've done that. So give us a ring give us an email something because man Rob that's that is that's just perfect. I agree a hundred percent well we will talk to you again next week hope you have an amazing week we love you we cheer for you and we can't wait to hear how you are living life on purpose and embracing God's grace.

SPEAKER_00 40:07

Have an amazing week thanks for joining us today at the Church Talk Podcast we hope the conversation encouraged and challenged you we would love to hear from you. Email your questions or comments to Jason at churchtalkproject com. The Church Talk podcast with Rob and Jason is brought to you by the Church Talk Project we work to engage, equip and encourage pastors and church leaders around the world. Thanks for listening